Until Trump, I never imagined how fragile

[no_hypocrisy]

and disposable our democracy could be.

Everything I was taught seems illusory.

[Johnny2X2X]

1. I saw the Democracy cracking before Trump came along

Republicans could no longer win on ideas, so they decided to do away with democracy altogether rather than change their ideas.

[NJCher]

13. We had plenty of warning

I’ve been on the streets protesting since they tried to impeach Clinton.

[DENVERPOPS]

64. Some of us here

have been screaming our heads off ever since HWBush and his CABAL COMMITTED TREASON to corruptly install Reagan....

[Bluetus]

69. EVERY GOP Presidency since 1968 began with treason

Last edited Fri May 23, 2025, 12:14 PM - Edit history (1)

Nixon made a deal with the North Vietnamese to torpedo the peace talks and Nixon would give them a better deal once in office.

Reagan did the same thing with the help of GHW Bush to keep our Iranian hostages imprisoned into literally the hour after Reagan was sworn in. Reagan and Bush 1 shared that treason.

Bush 2 was corruptly installed by a radical SCOTUS, and we should have known it was crumbling then.

Trump's treason was arguably greater, making deals with Putin to run a highly targeted disinformation campaign through Facebook and Twitter. And there hasn't been a day since then that Trump hasn't done some new treasonous act, such as accepting a $600,000,000 bribe from another of our enemies.

Anybody who is just now catching on, well, that train left the station 60+ years ago and is now rolling at train-wreck speed.

[DENVERPOPS]

70. Exactly Bluetus

The perfect title for a book about the last 45+ years would be:

WHILE THE NATION SLEPT..............

AND

Everyone was walking up the jungle path, swatting at mosquitoes, and were oblivious to the herd of charging elephants...pun intended

[markodochartaigh]

72. Actually,

Nixon sabotaged the Paris Peace Talks by promising the South Viet Namese a deal which would benefit the leaders personally.


https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/notes-indicate-nixon-interfered-1968-peace-talks-180961627/

[Bluetus]

85. Correct. My mistake.

[Biophilic]

15. It's the 'winning' part isn't.

At some point republicans stop thinking about governing and started thinking about winning. Whatever that means to them. Winning became the end goal. Just like a football game or all the shows on tv that focused on winning. The Winner became the hero/heroine and the only important part, at the end, was that they won and they got the prize.

[Wounded Bear]

21. Yeah, trump is just the culmination of decades of RW attacks on democracy...

Last edited Thu May 22, 2025, 02:26 PM - Edit history (1)

You can trace some of the trump plan all the way back to Nixon, with a through line through Reagan and Bush Jr.

[CaptainTruth]

41. Presidential immunity dates to Nixon & the 1973 OLC memo.

It's been DOJ policy & practice for 50+ years based on that OLC opinion, & the GOP (with Trump's help) finally succeeded in elevating it from a memo to a SCOTUS decision after 50 years.

There were many opportunities to challenge it over those 50 years, while it was "just" an opinion/memo, but for some reason we chose not to. I don't understand why, but here we are.

[soldierant]

68. Back to Nixon and Roy Cohn and Roger Stone. Yes.

[Haru]

40. No Goodwill

Our democracy depends on the goodwill of men or women, we need more guardrails.

[WiVoter]

53. Selection 2000

Was it for me

[pfitz59]

56. me too

Fat Tony did us wrong!

[brush]

76. Started with Nixon, then Reagan. They can't win without cheating.

And with TSF and Musk, they're out in the open with it now as they throw as much money as the can at it.

[samnsara]

2. how in Gods name did it unravel so easily

[lastlib]

11. Two words:

Citizens United.

Make it four: Powell Manifesto, Citizens United.

[Mysterian]

20. Two more words

Mitch McConnell

[lastlib]

43. Yeah, I can see that.

Certainly an ingredient.

[Mr.WeRP]

38. Letting Nixon get away with a pardon deal

Would be the very beginning.

[LymphocyteLover]

63. two more: Fox News

[proud patriot]

82. two more words

Clear channel

[hadEnuf]

27. And let's not forget 30 years of non-stop subversive propaganda brainwashing on radio, TV and then internet

that has never been addressed or countered in any meaningful way. We now have generations that have been brought up on this shit. And we've sat and watched it happen.

What did we honestly expect the outcome was going to be?

[Cirsium]

46. How did people not notice?

The right wingers have been chipping away at the foundations for a half century, ever since the successes of the Civil Rights movement, methodically, relentlessly. Those pointing that out have been dismissed, have been called alarmists or purists, accused of being unrealistic and impractical, too radical, etc.

I am only surprised that anyone is surprised.

[Celerity]

74. Social media algorithmic manipulation, now hyper powered by AI. It's the annihilation of truth.

Look at how easily even people here are duped, taken for a ride.

[EYESORE 9001]

3. I would argue that civilization itself is fragile

Once people’s safety and security needs are no longer being met, it’s a dystopian future come to pass.

[misanthrope]

75. Bingo

Most of us retain our sanity through curated ignorance. Look at how we learn to ignore the dangers all around us, like automobiles.

[underpants]

4. No more contempt charges.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=20335004

[Johonny]

5. It isnt just Trump, it is the RW media appartus

Without FOX news and the RW mediasphere, Trump could never have existed. By allowing propaganda to replace news, America paved the way for a complete piece of shit to become president, twice!

[Mysterian]

19. And the willfully stupid portion of our populace

who revel in their ignorance and hate.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

6. "The price of liberty is eternal vigilance". Too many people sleep-walking through life. . . . nt

[Mr.Bee]

7. Years Ago

Thom Hartmann frequently uses the phrase "this can all be taken away so easily" in his political commentary, particularly when discussing the fragility of democracy and the potential for its erosion...

[Autumn]

8. That it was. I never though it would be this easy to destroy the country.

I thought it would take bombs and war. I really thought there would be a resistance force.

[JohnnyRingo]

9. He couldn't have done it without a corrupt Supreme Court and House majority.

John Roberts could have stopped him with the immunity ruling. The House of Reps are paving the way to a dictatorship.
Soon Trump will have no use for either body, but by then it's too late.

[Starbeach]

24. Rocket Fuel

Roberts et al. handed him a Superman complex and his minions bowed down.
Catastrophic decision. Fueled his dominance.

[cilla4progress]

10. It seems awfully easy for that orange piece of shit

to get away with it all.

[Botany]

12. This is a result of a multi year misinformation campaign by the right, big money, and which

Russia/Saudi Arabia/the fossil fuel industries/and Christo Evangelical Fascism has
plugged into. Generational stupidity, racism, and sexism are driving forces.

The democrats win when the people vote and republicans win when they stop people
from voting.

[Wounded Bear]

23. Multi-decade...nt

[Botany]

25. See Ronald Reagan and Iran Contra

Oliver North was a grifting crook but our right wing echo chamber sold him as
some kind of super patriot hero.

[Wounded Bear]

32. Actually goes back to Nixon...

and North was a weasel that disgraced the Marine Corps uniform, IMHO of course.

[Botany]

36. It goes back to even before that

Attacks on FDR and his work to get us out of the Great Depression and the pro Nazi
shits prior to WW II
Joe McCarthy’s made up attacks on the “known Communists in Government.”

@ one time the Republicans had some outstanding people in their party such as
Gov. Ray Shafer of PA who was one of the finest men I have ever known… I was a
kid and his brother lived next door and he would for some reason liked to talk to me
me when I was fishing in a little neighborhood lake or play ball with the kids in the
neighborhood. Those days of good republicans are long gone.

The bill the GOP just passed is a death sentence for America if it becomes law.

[keep_left]

50. I remember when the NYT actually ran op-eds warning about North...

...and the adulation he was getting from the far-right at the time. Of course, this was long before Fox "News" and all its imitators today. They warned that the hero-worship of North represented an American-style fascism. How times have changed.

[NJCher]

14. It's only temporary

You will understand why if you watched Lawrence last night.

[Biophilic]

22. What an unhelpful and useless comment.

Either join the conversation or walk away.

[Escurumbele]

16. The founders never expected someone like trump to be voted into the presidency. The founders sinned of having

too much faith in we the people to make the right decisions.

To their defense though, this has been building for some time. republicans have been weakening education, Democrats have not done enough to counteract those actions when in power, without education people will believe anything that is well presented to them, and the one thing republicans do very well is propaganda.

[RobinA]

44. The Founders

didn't have too much faith in the voters, that's why we're stuck with the Electoral College. Which, when called upon, failed to do its job.

[JHB]

45. The founders had classical education, and knew from the Greeks and Romans that scoundrels could win favor

It's part of the reason why separation of powers and checks & balances were built in.

What they didn't foresee is entire blocs of members of Congress handing their minds and spines over to someone else.

[andym]

78. The founders did not anticipate the creation of political parties and the power of group mentality

that occurred just after the founding of the nation. The tendency to support party and the party leader, Trump, over country is so evident today. The rule of law has been forgotten by the GOP.

[relayerbob]

17. 1984. It Can't Happen Here. Many others

They were fiction, but far from impossible. Democracy requires a firm commitment from all (or least most) of its citizens. That's been lacking/declining since the 1980s, and took a huge leap off the cliff, starting with Newt Gingrich. Sadly, our schools have been decimated over the years, thanks to the GQP

[Irish_Dem]

26. Our democracy is held together with spit and a prayer.

It is only the honor system and gentlemen's agreement.
We have no honor, nor any gentleman.

It is a farce.

[bronxiteforever]

28. Kick. This! I was telling my family this

the other day. Why did I read any American history with the language extolling our sacred documents and beliefs? I was a big fool. I have been scammed and let myself be scammed.

[walkingman]

29. Money buys influence - it is a real and present danger.

[Hugin]

30. I'm right there with you.

Somehow, we got disconnected as a whole from a personal understanding of the need to fiercely protect our fragile democracy. I guess thinking that someone was handling it, we put away our torches and pitchforks.

[Martin Eden]

31. Laws must be administered by public servants

Trumpism serves only itself, and Putin.

[Orrex]

33. I resent a lifetime of indoctrination telling me that cheaters will get caught in the end

And that crime doesn't pay.

[PatSeg]

34. Yes, I've said the same thing several times

It took so long with so much effort to get to where we are and one brainless clown can come along and destroy it in a matter of months. It is really horrifying.

[Nigrum Cattus]

35. White "christian" nationalists

2025 "project"
ALL repugs hate America

[Cheezoholic]

37. I had very good history and civics teachers along with a very wise parent who taught me how fragile freedom is

Oppressive regimes are harder to topple and many take forces from the outside where as democracies are much more fragile and are easily toppled from the inside. The simple fact that we are free is both the strength and the weakness. It is that delicate balance our country must always walk.

Much of what is being done is a culmination of a slow and steady war on our freedom for a very long time that has been completely ignored. Much of what this AssHat has been doing was enabled by remnants still in our laws from The Patriot Act which vastly expanded the powers of the Executive branch and consolidated many parts of government under one umbrella in DHS which both should have been removed and absolved when we had the chance in 2008-10. In line with what put him and the critters in power were the several SCOTUS rulings that gave money a vote. We had a couple of chances to counter SCOTUS with the check the founders meant to have on them by passing laws against that.

We are not going to fix this by passing a bunch of more restrictive laws as that is counter to the freedoms our founders envisioned. Rather a combination of new laws along with repealing oppressive legislation retaining the balance the founders intended.
IMHO
Peace

[Paladin]

39. Never doubt that you have lots and lots of company.

Decades of rightwing media empire-building, years and years of wimpy Democratic counter-responses, tens of millions of gullible Republican voters, capped off with a brain-dead dictator in the White House: Recipe for guaranteed disaster. And here we are...

[Chasstev365]

42. THE FOUNDING FATHERS IMAGINED A TRUMP

What they didn't contemplate was an entirely corrupt political party and Supreme Court giving the go head to for the president to become a dictator.

The focus of the 2026 midterms Must be to make all Republicans own this mess!

[republianmushroom]

47. These events are quite an eye opener.

This is not trump, this is the republican party.

[Montauk6]

48. Until Nov 2024, I never realized how S T U P I D too many American voters (and deliberate non-voters) could be

[BlueTsunami2018]

49. All he's done really, is do it openly.

And blatantly.

Presidents and Congresses have gotten away with tons of similar things. War crimes, treating with enemies, stealing and so on.

This asshole just doesn’t try to hide it.

[Evolve Dammit]

51. I somehow knew/sensed in 2015 that he was going to do this. His rhetoric and sociopathy was obvious then. n/t

[UTUSN]

52. K&R

[hay rick]

54. Democracy requires maintenance.

It's not something you inherit and ignore until the check engine light goes on.

[SharonAnn]

71. "Democracy is hard, it's messy, and you have to think a lot." President Bartlett, West Wing.

[Bluepinky]

55. Yeah, our democracy has been declining since Reagan turned people against the government and toward greed.

It took another sharp decline after George Bush was “appointed” as President in 2000. The interests of wealthy corporations have become so entrenched in our political system that they, and the oligarchs who own them, control all of it. Most of the Democrats failed to stop the takeover because they relied on corporate funding too.

[jgmiller]

57. Benjamin Franklin: "A democracy if you can keep it"

They all knew that this was all built on trust in the majority doing the right thing and using the checks and balances.

[JHB]

58. This isn't just Trump. This is the endgame of a 50-year effort to force a fundamental change on the nation.

The ball for this got rolling in the 70s. Trump wasn't part of it then. Neither was Putin. This was the "see commies under every rock" Movement Conservatives/RWers deciding the were going to wrest control of the country away from the Democrats and restore what was in their eyes the pinnacle of American civilization, the Gilded Age of the late 19th century. Before income taxes, before popular election of senators, and certainly before all those rights for the riff-raff. When the right sort of people had a firm grip on things.

They used focus groups to identify hot-button issues that could get people single-issue voting and made the Republicans the champions of those issues. They funded "think" tanks, college campus groups to direct like-minded young people their way, and their own media to catapult their propaganda. They worked the resentment and bile beat and ratcheted it up every year to polarize and radicalize Republican voters. As the Democrats moved away from the entrenched racism of segregationist days, the Republicans set up recruiting tables to scoop up those "former" Klan members and supporters.

By the 80s they had Reagan and launched the "greed is good" society. They began a campaign of putting only justists they saw as "conservatively correct" on the courts. They politically exterminated the Rockefeller Republicans, paving the way to begin attacking the Democrats in earnest. Bill Clinton was their worst nightmare: a centrist Democrat who was pro-business, ok with the death penalty, accepted the basic structure of Reganomics (tweaking it, yes, reversing it, no) and declaring that the days of Big Government were over. To the RWers, this was a threat because there were still moderate Republicans around, and if they decided "eh, we can work with this guy," the dream of destroying the last remnants of the New Deal would be out of their reach. He HAD to be treated as an enemy, and since he didn't fit the sterotypes of previous Democratic politicians, they just made shit up and had Rush Limbaugh and the rest of hate radio blast it on the airwaves for hours on end, every single day, all over the country.

It's been a steady process of taking over the GOP, trashing restrictions on funding, turning media into a one-sided megaphone, and turning the Party of Abe into the Party of Ahab. All with the goal of forcing through a wish-list that was eventually written down as Project 2025. The Russians weren't commies anymore, and their view of the way things ought to be overlapped a lot with Putin's. And with Trump, they had a vehicle they could use to ram though what they wanted.

[Mblaze]

59. IMO

Most of what we were taught is illusionary.

[Oneironaut]

60. We are not exceptional, sadly.

No nation is. Hope this is a warning to them.

[Skittles]

61. it wouldn't be if GOP allegiance was to AMERICA and not DONALD FUCKING TRUMP

INDEED

[Martin68]

62. Yes, it has been very distressing to see how easily Trump has managed to break laws, violate the constitution, and

break every ethics rule on the books. We cannily hope the courts will hold the line.

[cactuslady]

67. Brainwashing for 30 years

My husband changed from listening to Rush Limbaugh on the radio. I think he was like a father figure to my husband. Then there was also Bill O'Reilly on Fox. And now it is hard for me to believe that my formally "woke" and sensible husband thinks the 2020 election was rigged and that Trump is a great president.

[Joinfortmill]

73. Me, too. What I don't know, is a lot.

[C Moon]

77. It's almost like, if I commit a felony, maybe I can just walk out of the police station, and ignore the "STOP!" yelling.

Go home.
Grab a beer. Order a pizza. Watch tv. Ignore the door. Ignore any mail and phone calls.

[Hekate]

80. In 2016 I watched his campaign with horror, and with equal horror the GOP's response...

Anyone remember the old “smoke-filled room” stories of the ultimate power of political bosses in back rooms? Old guys with cigars and scotch deciding that some populist wasn’t going to be good for the Party (or them) ? Stories about how a National Convention could be derailed from behind the scenes?

Well, they don’t exist any more, if indeed they ever really did. The GOP sat silent. The GOP powers sat silent when trump tried to set a howling mob on a young female reporter — and silent when he instructed the mob to throw out a protestor into the winter weather without a coat — and all the other things we saw with our own eyes.

The RNC nominating convention was like nothing I’ve ever seen before in my lifetime. A normal nominee says thank you and gives a speech about how we’re the shining city on the hill or similar. Hope and change. Brings out the wife and kids. Not trump. He trots out his American Carnage vision.

It was so bad that two reporter/analysts from MSNBC sat in the darkened ballroom among the fallen balloons — both of them longtime Republican operatives, just stunned. I don’t remember what Nicolle Wallace said, but I remember Steve Schmidt talked about the US Constitution and was choked with tears. They were in at the death.

Listen guys. I still thought we could pull off getting Hillary elected, right until she wasn’t, and I was alone and sick at heart without DU to turn to for days and days.

Every day since then that trump has been in office has been like being in a car driving right off a cliff, wondering when we are going to hit bottom, only there is no bottom. Thelma and Louise without the hearty laughs.

During his first term I gave a lot of thought to what kind of history I was living through and witnessing. Looking around the planet at other countries I saw the same populist fascist politics at play. I thought: end of a cycle, maybe even a Kali Yuga.

For the first time in my entire life I began to understand why so many Germans kept quiet — they were keeping their heads down, they were trying to survive the madness.

Looking at voting patterns, and laws designed to keep all women firmly in “their place” and obeying men — laws designed to keep all POC in “their place” — laws that threaten expulsion and concentration camps to anyone that crosses the path of ICE — it has occurred to me that half this country sincerely wants slavery to exist. I don’t know what else you can call laws that forbid women to even travel if someone imagines they might be pregnant, or jails women for having a miscarriage, that kind of thing. They want an uneducated and impoverished permanent underclass, too.

Getting Joe Biden elected was a respite, a chance to correct our course — and we failed, because trump is back, this time with a plan in hand (Project 2025) and many people eager to fulfill it.

Democracy is not an illusion, but it requires attention and maintenance, and our failure was to become flabby and lazy in our thinking, and not know how to respond to evident danger. I don’t think all is lost forever, but at my age I doubt I shall live to see my country repair even a tenth of the damage already done.

I hope I haven’t rambled on too much. I started this many hours ago, had many interruptions, and wanted to finish the thought, for whatever that is worth.

🪷🪷🪷🪷🪷🪷🪷🪷🪷🪷

[donheld]

81. People need to acknowledge

It started as far back as Reagan. Pushed along by the likes of Rush Limbaugh and Fox News, for many many years. A great deal of it has been pushed by the likes of the Heritage Foundation.

[synni]

83. My mother saw this coming back in 2000

Bush vs. Gore

[Patton French]

84. This too shall pass.

Our democracy is stronger than one lunatic.