'This is odd': Yale doctor flags 'inconceivable' part of Joe Biden's cancer news

[JohnSJ]

"Howie Forman, a professor of radiology and biomedical imaging, public health (health policy), management, and economics at Yale University.

Forman said, "It is inconceivable that this was not being followed before he left the Presidency."

"Gleason grade 9 would have had an elevated PSA level for some time before this diagnosis. And he must have had a PSA test numerous times before," he added. "This is odd. I wish him well and hope he has an opportunity for maximizing his quality of life."

An X user named Adam Brown responded to Forman, saying, "If they followed the guidelines of the AUA and US Preventative Services Task force, they would have stopped PSA testing at age 70."

https://www.rawstory.com/this-is-odd-biden-doctor/

[BootinUp]

1. Last I checked, Biden doesn't lie about his health. nt

[JohnSJ]

2. This has nothing to do with Biden, but most likely the physician who didn't monitor the Presidents PSA

because of the asinine recommendation not to check PSAs on people older than 70.

By the time a nodule is felt, or a gleason grade hits 9, the PSA is probably very high, and if they had been regularly monitoring it, it would have probably been caught much earlier.

Someone really needs to answer some questions, and it isn't President Biden, but his doctors.

[LisaL]

3. What is the reason for this recommendation?

It makes no sense to stop testing at age 70. Don't cancer odds go up with age?

[JohnSJ]

7. It is based on faulty assumptions made 30+ years ago that have to do with life expectancy, and the false

assumption that the "cure" is worse than the disease.

These assumptions were based on old technologies, and ignores current significant advancements.

For one, people are living longer, and two a multitude of newer more effective treatments with less side-effects are available.

Buffet was 81 when he was diagnosed with prostate cancer, had treatment with Proton therapy, a type of radiation therapy, and at 93 is going strong. There were irresponsible physicians who were publicly criticizing why he had treatment then based on the 70 year old standard, and Buffet has proven them wrong, and has most likely avoided a lot of potential suffering he might have had if he wasn't treated.

[Meowmee]

11. To save money basically... but it doesn't in the end

Many would prefer that people just die, especially older people.

[dsc]

4. what is the reasoning for that?

I realize that prostate cancer is slow moving and all of that, but it does seem like a really dumb idea. Life expectancy at age 70 is long enough that it seems the tests should continue.

[ITAL]

5. US males have a life expectancy of about 79

So my uneducated guess is that since prostate cancer is fairly slow moving, that once you get to 70 you're on average likely to die before the cancer would kill you.

[marble falls]

8. Unless it's metastasized to other structures, like skeletal system. Colon, bladder and prostate cancers, fortunately ...

... all unrelated and now five years cancer free on June 19th. There are all sorts of advances in cancer treatment; almost daily. I'm sure President Biden is getting the maximum of care. I know I did.

[ITAL]

12. Well sure

That's why I said on average. Not every case fits the average, but generally those sorts of standard tests are done with the average in mind.

[Meowmee]

18. Not all prostate cancers are slow moving

[ITAL]

22. I said on average

[Meowmee]

23. On average is not a valid way to determine testing and treatment 😁

[ITAL]

25. Well, they definitely take that sort of thing into consideration

Otherwise they would test for a lot of things at both earlier and older ages than they do.

[Meowmee]

26. Yes the people who want to control monetary costs do that

And it varies by doctor as well. It is a mistake because it can cost people their lives.

[ITAL]

29. I mean it's monetary costs, sure

But also math. If the chance that someone isn't likely to get say....esophageal cancer before 60, they're not gonna test 30 year olds -- even though I'm sure there is the occasional 30 year old who gets it.

[Meowmee]

30. Wrong... only a bad doctor would not test someone with suspected cancer whatever their age 😁

That is the whole point.. please read up on this.

[ITAL]

32. Talking about different things here

A doctor is unlikely to jump to suspecting some cancers initially for younger people because the chance of them appearing is so low -- where for someone older they'd be more likely to immediately think that's what someone has.

[Meowmee]

34. Please read about it 😁

[JohnSJ]

9. It is based on faulty reasoning in place over 30+ years ago, and ignores the significant technological

advances made diagnostically and treatment wise, which is more effective with less side effects.

Dogma in the medical community is sometimes slow to accept new approaches.

Not so long ago, prostate cancer always meant immediate treatment, usually surgery. Today a low grade prostate cancer with a gleason grade of 3+3 or even 3+4 makes active surveillance a viable option. That would have never been accepted not that long ago, but is now a standard option.

Mercury was used in medical treatments for centuries, despite its known toxicity, for all kinds of ailments from syphilis, depression, skin diseases, etc.

Just look at today how so many people do not believe in vaccines.

[Meowmee]

17. Some doctors are trying to do a similar thing for women now also

No pap tests after 60 or so and changes in mammography testing. And in many other areas. It is especially negligent because a person's chance to develop many of these cancers goes up with age.

[Liberal In Texas]

14. It's hard to believe a physician attending the President of the US wouldn't do a routine PSA when the other

routine blood work was being done. Even if this don't bother after 70 nonsense the medical team was attending to the President!
Heck, I'm 75 and I get the PSA every year and I have never had a doctor tell me I shouldn't bother.

It's possible they did find this last year and maybe it was too late for effective treatment.

[Meowmee]

21. In some cases the psa does not go up significantly

depending on the type of tumor/cancer and the stage. And psa levels can fluctuate. However a certain increase warrants a biopsy to determine if it's cancer. Other things can cause an increased psa. Many don't want to do a biopsy. I know someone who ended up doing a blood test instead for various cancers which I thought was a mistake.

What happened with my father was negligent, because his psa did go up enough to warrant a biopsy, but his doc, who was in the middle of a divorce at the time, didn't do it. So it was much more advanced when discovered. Fortunately he survived. It was an aggressive cancer.

https://santishealth.org/psa-test-prostate-cancer/#:~:text=Yes%2C%20PSA%20levels%20can%20fluctuate,other%20parts%20of%20the%20body.

[Liberal In Texas]

47. Dr. Gupta on MSNBC said he probably has had this for about 2 years.

It's just unbelievable that White House physicians or Bethesda didn't see it.

[Meowmee]

50. No it is not unbelievable

Please reread the info. Dr. G is not that great.

[Renew Deal]

38. How did you check

And how would you really know?

I’m not saying he lied but there’s no way for you to know without being his doctor.

[BootinUp]

39. The public record. nt

[marble falls]

6. My thought, too. I'm not casting aspersion: my fight with multiple cancer surgeries has taught me I don't know ...

... everything there is about cancer. But Walter Reed Hospital fer Pete's sake.

[JohnSJ]

10. One would think, unless they were following that stupid "recommendation", no need to test for someone

older than 70 years.

All the best to you marble.

[marble falls]

15. I'm doing well, thanks, man. They found my colon cancer three years after a Proctologist told me I was clear ...

... and not to have another til I was 75. My primary care physician made go back in three years. The 'scopy found a ton of polyps he stopped removing because they were beyond his tools, and I had surgery within two weeks. They took enough colon to get what they were worried about and I didn't have to wear a bag. If I had listened to the Proc', they'd have to have taken more or maybe all of my colon, and who knows when it would have been discovered.

If I had lost all of my colon, I don't know what I would have had done because my bladder cancer required completely removing my bladder and the tubes to the kidneys. Those tube were replaced by pieces of my remaining colon. And the bladder removal required removal of my prostate - which was found to have cancer.

Thank G*D for VA. I love my socialized health care.

[JohnSJ]

33. Wow, your primary care was really on top of things. If you are in VA, you earned it through you service

Again stay well.

[marble falls]

42. John, I've had "cadillac" insurance. VA tops any of it. In 12 years, I've only had two primary care physicians ...

... and the first one left to go upstairs to work in the women's medicine group.

Both of my primary physicians have been immigrant Muslim women. They both are MDs and Osteopaths. They have been wonderful and seriously advocated for me to get everything they thought I needed. I've found that I prefer women doctors to men. Male doctors tell you, and women doctors listen to you.

About three years ago I started getting sick. I felt like I did when cancer first got me. All the male doctors kept saying it was UIs, I was almost at cellulitis once, but the men kept pushing UI treatments. My doctor decided nonr of it was working that what my Brigadier General Urologist prescribed was NOT the right medication. She fought for a contagious disease specialist, got me hospitalized for a bunch tests preceded by 15 tubes of blood including two that looked like a pint. For the previous eight or so months I had had Brucelosis. After about three months of a lot of antibiotics it appears I am over it. Have no idea whatsoever where I might have gotten it. But it kicked the snot out of me!!!

It slays me when I hear people cry "creeping" socialism, when the US Federal government carries on one of the largest socialized health care schemes on the planet. Let's get more people on it and let those who benefit from our work and purchase, the wealthy, get taxed to pay for it. They maintain their machinery, they maintain their families, their mistresses/lovers, the pets and livestock: take care of us.

[gab13by13]

13. I'm 77 and I get a PSA test every 6 months.

[marble falls]

16. I get it!

[JohnSJ]

35. It is a simple test, and can save lives.

[babylonsister]

19. Some things are private, even if you've been a president.

He probably knew a lot more than he let on.

Devastating, my thoughts are with the Bidens.

[DET]

20. An Important Note

Black men are at significantly higher risk for prostate cancer and tend to have poorer outcomes. Make sure that you or your loved one gets tested every year.

[LudwigPastorius]

24. Odd, but not impossible...

to go from a first-time elevated PSA result to stage 4 cancer in a year.

Personally, I don't think this is the time to start debating "what did he know and when did he know it'. But, I suppose the media has to have something negative to write about Joe.

[rickyhall]

27. Good to know. I turn 70 in October.

[rickyhall]

28. Good to know. I turn 70 in October.

[crimycarny]

31. JFC--now Joe Biden has to defend against "hiding" his cancer?

What the hell? Biden gets a devastating diagnosis of cancer and instead of sympathy people are going to accuse him of a cover up?

I give up.

[JohnSJ]

36. No one is accusing HIM of covering up. The problem is that his physician is probably using the outdated

recommended standard of no need for PSAs after 70.

and if they used that recommendation, they are putting the patient at risk.

and if others follow that recommendation, they will be put at risk also.

[crimycarny]

37. Yes, they are

Because the whole “Why weren’t they checking him more frequently” gets so easily spun into “they were! He just hid it!”

Let’s leave the speculation up to President Biden and his doctors. The accusation is either 1) someone dropped the ball or 2) Biden knew and hid it.

NEITHER of those are helpful to President Biden as he processes this. Let’s give the President the dignity of filling in the details himself before we gossip about things we don’t know. Let’s at least allow him 24 hours of privacy before we run our “forensic analysis”. I know one thing, if anything lacking in the current guidelines led to Joe not getting his diagnosis sooner, Joe will be the first one to address the need for change. I’ll wait to hear from Joe, not random doctors or laymen. I’ll at least give Joe the dignity to own his own disease.

[JohnSJ]

40. Biden's communication staff announced it. They actually announced they felt a lump with a DRE.

What is frustrating is the assumption by some people that it is all over for President Biden, which is NOT necessarily the case. In fact there are treatment options that can last for years.

For anyone actually interested, here is one of the leading Prostate Oncology physicians in the country explaining the situation:

https://pcri.org/news/2023/4/30/metastatic-prostate-cancer-treatment-case-study-mark-scholz-md-alexscholz-pcri

[Sugarcoated]

41. There's a similar blood test for women and ovarian cancer

But it isn't recommended unless there's reason to suspect a woman might have it (from symptoms that are vague and could be so many other things)
because of so many false positives/negatives.

[JohnSJ]

43. I believe you are referring the protein CA-125, but I believe its use is mostly for monitoring how treatment is going.

[Princess Turandot]

44. It can be used as a diagnostic tool to supplement other findings...

I had the test done after my gynecologist and ultrasound found growths on my ovaries, back in the day.

[JohnSJ]

48. Thanks

[Melon]

46. Well....his doctor should be defending how a president is not checked early enough to catch it.

He was clearly sliding health wise at the end of his presidency. He is the leader of the country. There is no possible way that he wasn’t getting increased doctor care at his age. Plus a prostrate check is the most basic test. At his age….at his importance…


Denying it from any of us won’t stop the speculation…because only incompetence or worse would make more sense than the president having prostate cancer so advanced its spread to his bones.

[DUU]

52. When it comes to (any) cancer blunt truth is required

Too many families have had to face prostate and other cancers with a loved one. Objectivity and care of the patient needs to be the focus.

(Sorry, this is my first post, was hoping something more mainstream, but felt compelled to reply as this has hit our family several times, and diagnosis, support and treatment needs to be the only factors discussed).

[Delphinus]

53. Welcome to DU!

And sorry that you have first-hand knowledge of this.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

54. Welcome to DU

[Deep State Witch]

49. My Guess Is

That they spotted some irregularities when he had COVID last year. Because, notice that he dropped out of the race shortly after that. It was probably one of those "this looks odd, we're going to keep an eye on it" situations.

[BurnDoubt]

51. My Dad was diagnosed in 1996. He survived, and quite well, until 2023...

Physically active and vital until four months short of his 95th trip around the Sun. In any condition, Biden is better for America than the alternative. AND: "Any man who saves Democracy isn't breaking the Law"... AND: "Immunity"
Let's move on from this and get back to investigating the Criminal In Chief for 'flooding the zone" in all manner of criminality, including co-opting and intimidating the Judiciary. This is a Red Ball, people.